I completely understand the buffs to some chars and the nerfs to others, BUT HAVE YOU LOST YOUR MIND TO COMPLETELY REMOVE LETHAL FROM ALL DAGGERS??? You want to see over and over again same chars in late game? HE/glad HE/warlord parties few destroyers and mages only!!! Not only that they will have problems with mana but they wont even do a single lethal by any luck. I understand the lethal chance to be at really low chance to happen but completely not doing any you are making the daggers miserable as much as possible.
Quote from: Rayden on November 14, 2021, 12:49:58 PM
I completely understand the buffs to some chars and the nerfs to others, BUT HAVE YOU LOST YOUR MIND TO COMPLETELY REMOVE LETHAL FROM ALL DAGGERS??? You want to see over and over again same chars in late game? HE/glad HE/warlord parties few destroyers and mages only!!! Not only that they will have problems with mana but they wont even do a single lethal by any luck. I understand the lethal chance to be at really low chance to happen but completely not doing any you are making the daggers miserable as much as possible.
What? Being able to one-two shot pretty much all mage characters with 2 rings (and no you have free 1 ring from olympiad if you attend) is not fair? Lethal is good to be removed as it SUCKs to be on the receiving end of the RNG part of the game. Win fair and square not face-backstabbing hoping for the 10%(retarded base lethal blow rate).
And if daggers are not doing enough damage to be able to do what they are supposed to do - then it is worth to open a thread and discuss it.
Then why we don't simply remove the magic critical from spells? Why we don't remove the critical hits from archers? Why we don't remove the frenzy and zealot from orcs? And best of all since this is INTERLUDE why we don't remove chant of protection because that dogshit skill is reducing all dagger skill damage because they are ALL CRITICAL HITS!!!
Quote from: Rayden on November 14, 2021, 02:57:45 PM
Then why we don't simply remove the magic critical from spells? Why we don't remove the critical hits from archers? Why we don't remove the frenzy and zealot from orcs? And best of all since this is INTERLUDE why we don't remove chant of protection because that dogshit skill is reducing all dagger skill damage because they are ALL CRITICAL HITS!!!
You are right, we should ask them to remove shadow step and self cleanse from daggers. The only issue they had on interlude is getting close to the enemy to one-shot them with backstab seems not be needed but lethals are more important /s
That is the point it is INTERLUDE!!! Dagger can always manage his way to the enemy even without those 2 features shadow step and the imaginary break duress. But once he is near you now he can't even lethal you for some reason because a cry baby like your own can't play a dagger properly. Remove shadow step, remove break duress bring back lethals and then show me your point!
First of all, you lose all the possible credibility by being an absolute arrogant dkhead with your wording.
Other than that, to argue the point, daggers are literally in the best spot they have been for the last couple servers. It is an actual fact, not an opinion. Full Lethal is just bad for the game and you are letting this cloud your judgement. There is absolutely no world where shadowstep + self cleanse is worse than being able to full lethal.
Full lethals are one of the worst things that were ever created in whole L2 history (except destros ofc). A random chance to almost instantly kill ANY target with no way of counter play and without any requirement or preparation. There is a reason why lethals were changed in later chronicles (same with destros frenzy).
If a dagger has good gear/buffs and aq and/or baium, he can 1shot any mage with crit from backstab anyway. Whats more they even have shadow step to instantly get behind an enemy.
Quote from: Rayden on November 14, 2021, 02:57:45 PM
Then why we don't simply remove the magic critical from spells? Why we don't remove the critical hits from archers? Why we don't remove the frenzy and zealot from orcs? And best of all since this is INTERLUDE why we don't remove chant of protection because that dogshit skill is reducing all dagger skill damage because they are ALL CRITICAL HITS!!!
That rant about mage/archer criticals couldnt be more ridiculous. There are many ways to reduce archers/mages dmg - buffs like deflect arrow, bless shield, adv block, ele prot etc or enchanting armor/jewels and yet you compare that to lethals that cannot be ressisted in any way? wtf srsly...
But im all up for removing frenzy, or even better lets remove destros! ;D
Quote from: Rayden on November 14, 2021, 04:35:44 PM
But once he is near you now he can't even lethal you for some reason because a cry baby like your own can't play a dagger properly.
So playing properly as a dagger means lathaling ppl? OK, at first i thought you are just a lil bit misguided but after reading that part you are either a bad troll or completly retarded lunatic :o
It seems that not even one of you have tried the dagger place at this point! If you think that 1100-1200 backstab is OK with AQ+baium+all skills+9 vs mage/tank with not a single skill enchanted compared to his 1k-4k hydro blasts with elemental protection on 2k m def then it is probably my fault for not understanding about the lethal removal! :D Enjoy your archer/mage server once again and i will meet you at olympiad since that is what you want! Have FUN!
Quote from: Rayden on November 14, 2021, 07:13:37 PM
It seems that not even one of you have tried the dagger place at this point! If you think that 1100-1200 backstab is OK with AQ+baium+all skills+9 vs mage/tank with not a single skill enchanted compared to his 1k-4k hydro blasts with elemental protection on 2k m def then it is probably my fault for not understanding about the lethal removal! :D Enjoy your archer/mage server once again and i will meet you at olympiad since that is what you want! Have FUN!
vs mage/tank? Yes, it is OK. Mage/tanks are specifically made to counter archers and daggers - bcs of shield def (yes blows can be blocked with shield) but at the same time mage/tanks are loosing to mage/summoners.
Try to use backstab on any nontank mage, u will easly reach 4.5k+ dmg with backstab crit on mages with pow/magnus and little less with mages on cov. And thats WITHOUT aq/baium - add it and u have 6k+ dmg that can 1shot or almost 1shot any nontank mage. Btw there will be way more non tank mages than mage/tanks, at most you will see 3 tanks in mage pt, most often it would be less, probably 2.
There is not a single sub that is good against everything...
Quote from: Rayden on November 14, 2021, 07:13:37 PM
1k-4k
Brother, you must be as high as a kyte. I played sps last server, had arcana mace +5 with empower passive (20% extra m.atk) AND Valakas and this numbers I could maybe reach if someone didnt have any water protection or were canceled out of the wazoo so please, lets not keep this bulshit conversation going
Quote from: Vexim on November 14, 2021, 05:50:11 PM
Full lethals are one of the worst things that were ever created in whole L2 history (except destros ofc). A random chance to almost instantly kill ANY target with no way of counter play and without any requirement or preparation. There is a reason why lethals were changed in later chronicles (same with destros frenzy).
If a dagger has good gear/buffs and aq and/or baium, he can 1shot any mage with crit from backstab anyway. Whats more they even have shadow step to instantly get behind an enemy.
That rant about mage/archer criticals couldnt be more ridiculous. There are many ways to reduce archers/mages dmg - buffs like deflect arrow, bless shield, adv block, ele prot etc or enchanting armor/jewels and yet you compare that to lethals that cannot be ressisted in any way? wtf srsly...
But im all up for removing frenzy, or even better lets remove destros! ;D
So playing properly as a dagger means lathaling ppl? OK, at first i thought you are just a lil bit misguided but after reading that part you are either a bad troll or completly retarded lunatic :o
How is it that you can connect every topic with your destr/orc-hate? Unbeliveable.
Quote from: iZsaka on November 15, 2021, 08:19:18 PM
How is it that you can connect every topic with your destr/orc-hate? Unbeliveable.
Destro is objectively the worst class that exists in L2 (from a certain point of view) and if u would just look at it from a broader perspective u would see that it literally damages game as a whole, anyway at this point this "delete destro" thing became a meme :)
oh btw i love ol and wc :P
Feel free to trash talk all you want, had enough time tested all needed saw the difference in damages from all perspectives. If this will make you happy you can close the topic also, simply daggers gets removed a "CHANCE" to kill tanks. You have no idea what a huge nerf that is to them. And BTW why does Wind Rider still has perma DODGE skill? Try kill that char with any other dagger user because it has over 80% chance to dodge ANY melee skills, YES it's CORRECT ANY MELEE SKILLS!!! And it can be up 24/7 actually as PW/SWS you have it ready 2 seconds before it fades. So by any meaning if AW or TH cannot lethal that char there is no chance of even touching it, everything goes in the air. I'm done arguing with trashes like you that wants to play their mage/archer server once again. If this is not fixed i will simply not go out of olympiad farming your sorry asses!
BYE
Quote from: Rayden on November 15, 2021, 09:34:52 PM
Feel free to trash talk all you want
Said by someone who is doing just that
GL on oly 8)
Quote from: Rayden on November 15, 2021, 09:34:52 PM
Feel free to trash talk all you want, had enough time tested all needed saw the difference in damages from all perspectives. If this will make you happy you can close the topic also, simply daggers gets removed a "CHANCE" to kill tanks. You have no idea what a huge nerf that is to them. And BTW why does Wind Rider still has perma DODGE skill? Try kill that char with any other dagger user because it has over 80% chance to dodge ANY melee skills, YES it's CORRECT ANY MELEE SKILLS!!! And it can be up 24/7 actually as PW/SWS you have it ready 2 seconds before it fades. So by any meaning if AW or TH cannot lethal that char there is no chance of even touching it, everything goes in the air. I'm done arguing with trashes like you that wants to play their mage/archer server once again. If this is not fixed i will simply not go out of olympiad farming your sorry asses!
BYE
Hello,
what class are you willing to play ? Is there any dagger class viable right now ? Didn't check the BETA that much and it seems you did it quite carefully.
RIP my PW/SR combo with 100% lethal blow uptime :D
Daium this thread is a mess.
I wonder if there will ever be a group of daggers and destros that would wreck havoc on the server and prove to all crybaby's that they are simply bad at the game...
Hm... Interesting...
Quote from: plavix on November 16, 2021, 12:51:14 AM
Daium this thread is a mess.
I wonder if there will ever be a group of daggers and destros that would wreck havoc on the server and prove to all crybaby's that they are simply bad at the game...
Hm... Interesting...
Why do I feel like you're hinting at something? 8)
Quote from: Rayden on November 15, 2021, 09:34:52 PM
Feel free to trash talk all you want, had enough time tested all needed saw the difference in damages from all perspectives. If this will make you happy you can close the topic also, simply daggers gets removed a "CHANCE" to kill tanks. You have no idea what a huge nerf that is to them. And BTW why does Wind Rider still has perma DODGE skill? Try kill that char with any other dagger user because it has over 80% chance to dodge ANY melee skills, YES it's CORRECT ANY MELEE SKILLS!!! And it can be up 24/7 actually as PW/SWS you have it ready 2 seconds before it fades. So by any meaning if AW or TH cannot lethal that char there is no chance of even touching it, everything goes in the air. I'm done arguing with trashes like you that wants to play their mage/archer server once again. If this is not fixed i will simply not go out of olympiad farming your sorry asses!
BYE
Who gives a shit about Olympiad ? That comment just proves the solo braindead player you are lol
When Olympiad started the server was dead.
I guess you don't know more than playing olys and exploiting the server ...
Can't wait to see you fighting for epics, oh wait you will be farming your oly gear xD
Also you are not a treat to anyone, our party got hero in 9 chars so I don't think we felt your impact LOL
Cry me a river !
_O< Quack
Quote from: PostonFernandes on November 16, 2021, 07:24:04 PM
Who gives a shit about Olympiad ? That comment just proves the solo braindead player you are lol
When Olympiad started the server was dead.
I guess you don't know more than playing olys and exploiting the server ...
Can't wait to see you fighting for epics, oh wait you will be farming your oly gear xD
Also you are not a treat to anyone, our party got hero in 9 chars so I don't think we felt your impact LOL
Cry me a river !
_O< Quack
That doesnt tell anything exept that you suck so hard you needed feeders to get there.
Sadly thats how it is in most hero cases, and thats why i (and by discusion a little back other ppl also), hope that hero rewards will be nerfed down to cosmetics
I actually support Rayden, that's a bit too much nerf for dagger classes to totally remove full lethals, I'd say keep this at a very low rate.
About the olympiad, I do agree that hero rewards should be nerfed down.
Quote from: Yvi on December 07, 2021, 09:22:31 AM
I do agree that hero rewards should be nerfed down.
this was an old post. but you mean this? https://forum.dragon-community.net/index.php/topic,299343.msg2538361.html#msg2538361
Quote from: Tessellate on December 07, 2021, 11:28:50 AM
this was an old post. but you mean this? https://forum.dragon-community.net/index.php/topic,299343.msg2538361.html#msg2538361
Yes! Didn't see these updates, but I like it! Keep up the good work, admins!
From what I'm seeing here mages are crying they are dying to daggers. That is common in all existing rpgs in the world. There are counter classes to mages yes. But L2 mage players are such crybabies they can't live if they are not the strongest out there.
Assassins should be able to kill mages with not much effort in most games.
They are gods 1v1, of course your stupid mage should die 1v1 to a mage, get freaking real.
This game had always complimented mages and now even more.
Further more flexing out you were 9 heroes (mage pt) by exploiting this old unbalanced game is really sad. Go and fight proper, oh wait you can't.
People here don't like to compete, they like to be on top.
You like killing people with C jewels while wearing A or S items and you thinking you're good... LMFAO
Removing the full lethal might be a good idea, but with chant of protection daggers are absolutely useless in mass pvps.
The discussion here seems to be missing completely and just a bunch of mages telling a dagger player he is retarded KEKL
Overall enjoy nolifing on your mages and then killing everyone cause they are below you and ungeared. Great fun!
Quote from: Chuen on December 07, 2021, 01:53:53 PM
From what I'm seeing here mages are crying they are dying to daggers. That is common in all existing rpgs in the world. There are counter classes to mages yes. But L2 mage players are such crybabies they can't live if they are not the strongest out there.
Assassins should be able to kill mages with not much effort in most games.
They are gods 1v1, of course your stupid mage should die 1v1 to a mage, get freaking real.
This game had always complimented mages and now even more.
Further more flexing out you were 9 heroes (mage pt) by exploiting this old unbalanced game is really sad. Go and fight proper, oh wait you can't.
People here don't like to compete, they like to be on top.
You like killing people with C jewels while wearing A or S items and you thinking you're good... LMFAO
Removing the full lethal might be a good idea, but with chant of protection daggers are absolutely useless in mass pvps.
The discussion here seems to be missing completely and just a bunch of mages telling a dagger player he is retarded KEKL
Overall enjoy nolifing on your mages and then killing everyone cause they are below you and ungeared. Great fun!
Hello, i couldn't disagree more!
Quote from: =^TrackZero^= on December 07, 2021, 01:58:15 PM
Hello, i couldn't disagree more!
On which part exactly?
I am agreeing removing full lethal might a good idea.
I don't see any reply on the nearly permanent DODGE issue even after nerfs, or the fact that AW would most probably shit on all other dagger classes with those buffs and nerfs.
Quote from: Chuen on December 07, 2021, 02:00:50 PM
On which part exactly?
I am agreeing removing full lethal might a good idea.
Quote from: Chuen on December 07, 2021, 01:53:53 PM
but with chant of protection daggers are absolutely useless in mass pvps.
1vs1 might be the same