About planned Dagger update

[Futile]

~ Revising dagger power and improvement to make that class "wanted" again , in same time ill revise some other skills

For discussions sake, i will start with a thesis.

The dagger class is not an unwanted class.

Surely enough, u see less of them in a mass pvp or siege, but thats only because its just not well suited, for running into a crowd, facing multiple targets.
Its an assassin class to dominate in 1v1 fights, its not a Rambo class to annihilate them all.

Furthermore its the only class, where a lvl 61 char, is able to kill without buffs, just a combat haste pot, a full buffed tank.

The most wanted subclass combinations are the ones with a support class. 2nd is currently a tank sub.
nobody wants to be 1 hitted by a vortex or a crazy archer.
But in fact, thats what a dagger class does.
He surprises you, and goes nuts with his stabs.

All i am saying is, revising the dagger power and to improve them, is a tricky business.
If lethal rate gets lowered, but dagger blows damage gets improved significantly, then it is the best solution.


Thanks for reading.

[Dag]

The most wanted subclass combinations are the ones with a support class.

well, this depend on your clan / friend etc.

if im sure i always have someone else buffin me.... i wont go fir sure to PP/th or BD/aw
tank/dagger is the way to go when u have good parties.

[Futile]

well, this depend on your clan / friend etc.

if im sure i always have someone else buffin me.... i wont go fir sure to PP/th or BD/aw
tank/dagger is the way to go when u have good parties.

and the someone else buffing u, has not a support class sub? what?
what about the hundred chars before l2walker and dualboxing, dont have support subs and all the oly chars?

[Alex]

well, this depend on your clan / friend etc.

if im sure i always have someone else buffin me.... i wont go fir sure to PP/th or BD/aw
tank/dagger is the way to go when u have good parties.

the point was is that most of people cant afford or just dont want to keep 100 buff bots in town and go back to town every 3 min for rebuff and support subs are wanted in pvp because when there are 9 ppl in party and each single support is controlled directly by a person and if they work like a team that party can do really a lot.

perhaps yet only archer party proved itself good in this way since archers are in general easier to control than any other class so u can put almost anyone on archer/support.

[kidicarus]

For discussions sake, i will start with a thesis.

The dagger class is not an unwanted class.

Surely enough, u see less of them in a mass pvp or siege, but thats only because its just not well suited, for running into a crowd, facing multiple targets.
Its an assassin class to dominate in 1v1 fights, its not a Rambo class to annihilate them all.

Furthermore its the only class, where a lvl 61 char, is able to kill without buffs, just a combat haste pot, a full buffed tank.

The most wanted subclass combinations are the ones with a support class. 2nd is currently a tank sub.
nobody wants to be 1 hitted by a vortex or a crazy archer.
But in fact, thats what a dagger class does.
He surprises you, and goes nuts with his stabs.

All i am saying is, revising the dagger power and to improve them, is a tricky business.
If lethal rate gets lowered, but dagger blows damage gets improved significantly, then it is the best solution.


Thanks for reading.

Well..... I've read your post and I can honestly say im not sure what you are trying to say. You usually have well thought through posts but this here doesn't look like one of them.

First of all there are pretty much 2 ways of increasing daggerpower without messing with all the other subclass option and that is either increase blow damage or lethal rate. (unless Drake decides to recode the blow crit rate)
And the community already made it pretty clear that power of blows and lower lethalrates is the way to go.

And the only way a lvl 61 dagger can kill a fullbuffed tank is with lethal.... Otherwise the dmg will be way to low per stab and you will run out of MP long before the tank runs out of HP.

And YES assasin type classes should indeed be able to kill most classes if they are alone with them. But that is not the case now... A fullbuffed TH with as+cd baium + aq and draco set hits a fullbuffed mage in robe for about 1,2k.
I don't know about you guys but imo that is pretty damn lame.. If the dagger hits a tanksubbed mage the dmg is around 800.

All stabs are easily overhealed nowadays except for crits and lethals... I can understand why the daggerclasses complain about it.

[Alex]

Well..... I've read your post and I can honestly say im not sure what you are trying to say. You usually have well thought through posts but this here doesn't look like one of them.

First of all there are pretty much 2 ways of increasing daggerpower without messing with all the other subclass option and that is either increase blow damage or lethal rate. (unless Drake decides to recode the blow crit rate)
And the community already made it pretty clear that power of blows and lower lethalrates is the way to go.

And the only way a lvl 61 dagger can kill a fullbuffed tank is with lethal.... Otherwise the dmg will be way to low per stab and you will run out of MP long before the tank runs out of HP.

And YES assasin type classes should indeed be able to kill most classes if they are alone with them. But that is not the case now... A fullbuffed TH with as+cd baium + aq and draco set hits a fullbuffed mage in robe for about 1,2k.
I don't know about you guys but imo that is pretty damn lame.. If the dagger hits a tanksubbed mage the dmg is around 800.

All stabs are easily overhealed nowadays except for crits and lethals... I can understand why the daggerclasses complain about it.

dude u are the only who understands me! xD

[Futile]

all i am saying is:
to improve dagger classes, is not to increase lethal rate (it already has been tried to often enough, and it was just not the right way)
the damage of the blows has to be increased and the current lethal rate needs to be lowered.

3-5 top equipped archers can shoot at a tank, and he does not care much, but if 3 dagger chars hit anyone, chances are high that a lethal will finish a tank, does not matter what kinda pdef he has.
He can be in dynasty, he can have shield of faith, he can even have vengeance, lethal blows don't care and thats not right.

Now imagine a dagger char making strong dagger blows and lethaling here and there, ignoring 20,000 hp from destroyers or 3000 pdef from tanks.

Time will show that the right way to go is, increasing the dagger blow damage, and keeping the lethal rate at a minimum.

[Dag]

thet's the point
for me, it has more sense a he/pp than a th/pp
th suits better to wk, or pal

and if anyone wanna support his clan... pp/bp pp/wk or some damn mutant.

[Ashlynn]

all i am saying is:
to improve dagger classes, is not to increase lethal rate (it already has been tried to often enough, and it was just not the right way)
the damage of the blows has to be increased and the current lethal rate needs to be lowered.

3-5 top equipped archers can shoot at a tank, and he does not care much, but if 3 dagger chars hit anyone, chances are high that a lethal will finish a tank, does not matter what kinda pdef he has.
He can be in dynasty, he can have shield of faith, he can even have vengeance, lethal blows don't care and thats not right.

Now imagine a dagger char making strong dagger blows and lethaling here and there, ignoring 20,000 hp from destroyers or 3000 pdef from tanks.

Time will show that the right way to go is, increasing the dagger blow damage, and keeping the lethal rate at a minimum.

but that was already said zillion of times before and we all know that.

thet's the point
for me, it has more sense a he/pp than a th/pp
th suits better to wk, or pal

and if anyone wanna support his clan... pp/bp pp/wk or some damn mutant.

nobody wants to play damned pp/bd, wc/bd, wc/sws, pp/sws. it is not even a way to play MMORPG. Imo it is much better and funnier to have active support classes in party rather than having buff bot nearby

[our4n0s]

tbh current lethal rate is ok, as far as  i heard it will not be changed, only dmg would be increased (~20%) (which is imo too low)

[zippobg]

I am Th/Pala and I prefer more dmg than lethals too. Its very sad when i am on AI+UE+Shield of Faith and 1 dagger lethal me :/

[MisiekIII]

20%? u are kiding.  The dager class owned in C3 only! after it Gm-s start cut them power. But its not the point look what dager class need to make stronger blows (DW,FIRE,COV,CAT) and the p.atk dont change anything if i have 1 p.atk or 10k p.atk i make the same blows!! The power of blows is still the same only armors and chars has much more p.def m.def (DN set,IC,draco,apella). look at mage or archers they got all the time beter webon's more p.atk(atk speed) , m.atk and what get dager? Funy IC dager witch CD what give me 100dmg more from blows? loooool

Then plsss STFU and stop QQ...

Sorry for my english