Tank "nerfs"

[Chicks]

Which level was the tattoo of WALL you tried?
Aggression from it is quite good if the tattoo is leveled up (up to a max leveled aggression skill, without enchant)
The aggression effect triggers (regardless of tattoo level) every hit on 10% chances (so basically around every 10 hits)
The aggression effect have additionally a "target me" effect (from 25% to 40%, based on tattoo level)

Level one, but it's not the point I want to bring. If a char cannot be efficient without a tattoo, don't you think it's a little unfair, compared to, for exemple, a mage or pretty any other char? While a mage will need a tattoo for his mana if he want to STAY in the fight, a tank cannot even tank atm without said tattoo.

Also, it should also trigger on aggression casting, (doubling/stacking the aggression). As I said, it's counter productive for a tank to hit a lot, making this tattoo uninteresting imho.

Also, what use is there to have a - atk speed tattoo, if all that matters is the number of hit? Why would we want to go for this option (if we are a tank that is)?

I admit I don't know about this target me effect, got any documentation on that? Or explain it?

[R0gan]

Alternatively we can leave the range untouched but reduce the critical damage or critical rate from bow itself when the skill is in effect.
for sure one or the other nerf are needed.

imo. 20% less atack speed, as i see om another cases seems much worse than simple touch a bit on crit rate, or crt power. or even take of a little range.

[=^TrackZero^=]

you just confirmed that mage/tank is kinda useless here

there is 1 SH/SK, not even one BP/PAL, SPS/TK or SORC/PAL, 1 nuker/tank /~70subs

1 month after server opened....


Anyway, i dont know how this topic became nerf friendly topic, a guy just asked for changelog thats all!!

Leave changes as it is, stop complaining based on fortune telling....

[Voodoo]

you just confirmed that mage/tank is kinda useless here

Don't worry you'll see a river of cry about mage tanks pretty soon.

[=drake=]

Level one, but it's not the point I want to bring. If a char cannot be efficient without a tattoo, don't you think it's a little unfair, compared to, for exemple, a mage or pretty any other char? While a mage will need a tattoo for his mana if he want to STAY in the fight, a tank cannot even tank atm without said tattoo.

Try higher level tattoo, tattoos are meant for:
lv1 tattoo = lv20 char
lv2 tattoo = lv40 char
lv3 tattoo = lv60 char
lv4 tattoo = lv70 char
emp tattoo = lv76 char


If the mage becomes more efficient thanks to enchanting skill, you MUST be his equal with your aggression enchanting to keep up the extra aggro he is going to take.

If the mage becomes more efficient thanks to a mana tattoo that let him use more skills, you MUST take a tattoo that let you aggro more times too (thats why exists the aggro tattoo).
Same applies if they use a tattoo to raise their cast speed: with a castspeed+10% means he gonna hit 10% more times.
Thats why aggro tattoo have 10% chances on each hit you deal to raise an "aggro" to balance it out.

To put it simple, in a party of 2 (easier example) with 1 tank and 1 mage.
If the mage is same level as you and have skills all +0, you are ok with your skills +0
If the mage have  dps skills +5, you need aggro skills +5 to compensate him.
If the mage have +10% cast speed from tattoo or any tattoo that let him deal more hits/gain more aggro, you need opposite on your side to counterbalance him.

Also, it should also trigger on aggression casting, (doubling/stacking the aggression). As I said, it's counter productive for a tank to hit a lot, making this tattoo uninteresting imho.

Is more common to have an autoattack, thats why is on it.
Consider that this tattoo have 10% chance on every hit, compared to the similar Augmentation that have, instead, only 1%.

I admit I don't know about this target me effect, got any documentation on that? Or explain it?

Yes, basically higher the level of the tattoo, bigger the "aggro points" that get sent to the monster.
Additionally, every WALL tattoo have a % of landing a "switch target to me" over the boss.
The chances scales with the monster level and they have a BASE %.
lv1 tattoo = 26%
lv2 tattoo = 30%
lv3 tattoo = 34%
lv4 tattoo = 38%
emp tattoo = 40%
This base % is the altered by the level of the monster.
Lv3 tattoo, for example, is aimed for a lv70 character, this means that toward a lv70 monster it will have exactly 38% chances to make him switch target fully toward you.
Considering that the aggression rate is 10% on each hit, this translates in a 3.8% chances, every hit, that the target will switch toward you (or, to make it easier, it will switch for sure toward you every +/-28 hits)
As the monster level goes higher the tattoo, the base chances drop by around 5% for each level.

[Clonage]

Alternatively we can leave the range untouched but reduce the critical damage or critical rate from bow itself when the skill is in effect.
for sure one or the other nerf are needed.

Why would you nerf it that way? If u want to Nerf DD/Tank combos why should you nerf "Pure Tank" combo. Just Let it be the way it is right now but make Minimum Range on Bows 600. The nerf still applys to Archers/Daggers classes with Deflect arrow in effect.

[Garn.]

Try higher level tattoo, tattoos are meant for:
lv1 tattoo = lv20 char
lv2 tattoo = lv40 char
lv3 tattoo = lv60 char
lv4 tattoo = lv70 char
emp tattoo = lv76 char


If the mage becomes more efficient thanks to enchanting skill, you MUST be his equal with your aggression enchanting to keep up the extra aggro he is going to take.

If the mage becomes more efficient thanks to a mana tattoo that let him use more skills, you MUST take a tattoo that let you aggro more times too (thats why exists the aggro tattoo).
Same applies if they use a tattoo to raise their cast speed: with a castspeed+10% means he gonna hit 10% more times.
Thats why aggro tattoo have 10% chances on each hit you deal to raise an "aggro" to balance it out.

To put it simple, in a party of 2 (easier example) with 1 tank and 1 mage.
If the mage is same level as you and have skills all +0, you are ok with your skills +0
If the mage have  dps skills +5, you need aggro skills +5 to compensate him.
If the mage have +10% cast speed from tattoo or any tattoo that let him deal more hits/gain more aggro, you need opposite on your side to counterbalance him.


Is more common to have an autoattack, thats why is on it.
Consider that this tattoo have 10% chance on every hit, compared to the similar Augmentation that have, instead, only 1%.
Yes, basically higher the level of the tattoo, bigger the "aggro points" that get sent to the monster.
Additionally, every WALL tattoo have a % of landing a "switch target to me" over the boss.
The chances scales with the monster level and they have a BASE %.
lv1 tattoo = 26%
lv2 tattoo = 30%
lv3 tattoo = 34%
lv4 tattoo = 38%
emp tattoo = 40%
This base % is the altered by the level of the monster.
Lv3 tattoo, for example, is aimed for a lv70 character, this means that toward a lv70 monster it will have exactly 38% chances to make him switch target fully toward you.
Considering that the aggression rate is 10% on each hit, this translates in a 3.8% chances, every hit, that the target will switch toward you (or, to make it easier, it will switch for sure toward you every +/-28 hits)
As the monster level goes higher the tattoo, the base chances drop by around 5% for each level.

u really dont get it.

tattooes are meant to be A PLUS, SOME KIND OF HELP. not a MUST. you're trying to tell ppl "ah! you need to use tattoo for your char to be ok!" while in every goddamn server with NO TATTOOES, admin just FIX the skills or class or whatever, not trying to avoid the problem.

[=drake=]

u really dont get it.

tattooes are meant to be A PLUS, SOME KIND OF HELP. not a MUST. you're trying to tell ppl "ah! you need to use tattoo for your char to be ok!" while in every goddamn server with NO TATTOOES, admin just FIX the skills or class or whatever, not trying to avoid the problem.

I think you need to read it again:
IF your party member uses a tattoo and raises his efficiency, then you MUST use too to raise yours.
I concur tattoos are a plus, but if someone raises the bar, you must raise too.
If no one uses tattoos, then you are good without tattoo too.

[Garn.]

If no one uses tattoos, then you are good without tattoo too.

that's the problem, tanks don't.

[=drake=]

that's the problem, tanks don't.

You can prove that?
Because we tested it extensively and, if no one uses tattoo there are ZERO issues with aggro management WITHOUT any tattoo, IF your dps friends uses their skills for reduced aggro (all dps classes have at least one and they exists for specifically THIS purpose!)

[Clonage]

I just dont get what's the reason to nerf "Pure Tank" when they are one step behind with all combos...

[=drake=]

I just dont get what's the reason to nerf "Pure Tank" when they are one step behind with all combos...

Pure tanks are not nerfed.
DPS classes that subclass to a tank to go in godmode are nerfed.